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2 replies, 3 voices Last updated by Profile photo of Steven Barrett Steven Barrett 4 weeks, 1 day ago
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  • #6004
    Profile photo of Mark2016
    Mark2016
    Participant
    @Mark2016

    “Yet as true as all this was, we must not suppose that the whole work of the Reformation was the result of a spiritual crisis in Luther. It was not, as some have asserted, a movement launched because some monk from the Augustinian Order thought he had received a divine insight into a problem which particularly bothered him. It was not the imposition of a highly gifted man of a subjective experience upon a band of followers. This is the gist of the position taken by the Roman Catholic historian Philip Hughes.”

    Source: http://hopeprc.org/pamphlets/the-relation-between-the-lutheran-and-calvin-reformation/

     

    You know, I’m inclined to take this catholic position and can’t help but feel he just dismisses the catholic take on Luther for the truth, for the sake of his own theology. Thoughts on this?

     

    #6005
    Profile photo of David W. Emery
    David W. Emery
    Keymaster
    @David W. Emery

    I take this quote as saying that Martin Luther was not the whole of the Reformation. In that sense, the assertion is obviously correct. Luther was the “first mover,” but there were many others involved and many forces at work.

    On the other hand, we should not dismiss Luther as a minor figure in history. His action was the match that lighted the fire, and within his own domain, he shaped the flow of events for many years.

    The Hope PRC (Protestant Reformed Church) website is Calvinist. Knowing this, it could be that the author wants to inflate the influence of John Calvin over that of Luther. Calvin’s ideas enjoy a wider circulation than Luther’s in North America today, thanks to the current popularity of the Evangelical movement as opposed to Mainline, but to say that Calvin was a more important thinker than Luther is stretching it.

    A word about the website you link: My protection software indicates that this site may be a phishing perpetrator; it could be a security risk.

    David

    #21242
    Profile photo of Steven Barrett
    Steven Barrett
    Participant
    @Steven Barrett

    I think one of the cardinal sins had a lot more to do with the onset of the reformation than theology. Envy. Political and economic envy. Which body called the shots and owned lots of land that was properly cared for, employed many serfs and managed to compete quite successfully with many of the lords n’ barons, (the robber kind or otherwise). What a coincidence: the answer just happens to be the first object of attack, the Church. And of course, the biggest irony is that the collection of colonies which eventually became the single most powerful (albeit officially unintended) Protestant nation in history, was formed by men who remembered well the horrors of the reformation back in their respective lands, particularly not-so-merrie England. And shortly after giving off a huge sigh of relief that the same collection of colonies formed a national constitution in the wake of Shay’s Rebellion, the leaders of the newly created country formed by the principles of the mostly Protestant English Enlightenment period, were shaken to their core by the violence directed against the very wealthy French aristocrats and this revolution threw out even any respect for any religion, straight out of the bath water and into the streets of Paris, Lyons, etc.

    Unreasoned and unbridled rage resulting from unrestrained greed and arrogance, fueled with bad theology and further poisoned with an even more anti-Christian “humanist” philosophy will always produce more guillotines, mass firing squads and gas chambers if we continue to forget Who is the Ultimate Authority.

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